Please Advise: Word 365 inserting random page breaks in Print Layout mode

I've just gotten a new laptop and purchased an Office 365 license.  I've been using 2010 on my old machine with no problems, but the old machine has bit the dust and I was unable to transfer over my license.  I've installed Office 365 and am having a major problem in Word.

I'm a writer, and am trying to work on my current book.  In Print Layout mode, Word is inserting random "page breaks" in the middle of pages.  I put this in quotation marks, because in Draft mode, these page breaks do NOT show up, nor do they show up when I click the show/hide paragraph marks, breaks, etc.  They're not actually "there", according to draft mode, but they are messing up my formatting royally in Print Preview.

If I print the pages, they also show up, ruining my document.

Since these "phantom breaks" do not show up in draft mode, etc, I cannot remove them, as there is nothing to remove.

If I try to backspace or delete them in Print Layout mode, it will simply delete the character before/after the "break" and bump the line up or down, keeping the bad break where it is.

The book cannot, of course, be published with this problem; it's ruining my work and if it can't be repaired, I'm concerned about my livelihood.

Here are screenshots:

Print Layout mode, red arrow pointing to the bad break: http://sdrv.ms/141iyS1
Draft mode showing that the "break" does not exist: http://sdrv.ms/10bO9jr

Since I obviously can't repair what isn't there, and this is going to prevent me from earning a living, I can really use your help fast.  Please advise.


Thanks!
Gayle N.

Update: 

I tried moving a copy of the file into Dropbox and opening it on our old desktop, which has Word 2010 installed.  The file was fine, the page breaks vanished, and all looked perfect again.

I resaved in 2010.  Returned to the new laptop and opened it in Word 365.  It looked fine there in Compatability Mode.

I resaved it as a new file, in .docx format, and Word 365 told me it had to be converted to the new format.  I gave the file a new name and saved.  Immediately, the bad page breaks reappeared in the same places.

Opened the original (last saved in 2010) again.  Once again resaved with a new name, this time checking the "maintain compatability with previous versions of Word" box.  No bad page breaks.

There appears to be a bug in Word 2013/365 mode.




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"draft mode" is irrelevant to final formatting, aka print preview.

Simply looking at screen captures helps a tiny bit, but it would be much better to see the affected text.

Could you extract a few segments that have this problem and post them on skydrive for us to look at directly?

The first capture shows a break in a totally unexpected place, the "middle" of the para. That there are 2 lines carried over to the next page is suspicious. There may be a "compatibility" option at play

If you want to try and trouble shoot it yourself, here is a tip and an addon tool that may help to expose hidden formatting that may be causing the problem.

 

Reveal Codes in Word - Is there life after “Reveal Codes”? - http://sbarnhill.mvps.org/WordFAQs/RevealCodes.htm .  This is an excellent article describing all of the native Word tools for discovering formatting.

 

Formatting Problems? Install CrossEyes - http://www.levitjames.com/Products/CrossEyes.aspx
http://www.howtogeek.com/164343/easily-view-formatting-codes-in-word-2010-using-crosseyes/ - a product review of the tool

This tool adds a pane that converts Word formatting into HTML/WordPefect like “codes”, displaying a WordPerfect like “Reveal Codes” pane. It is a great complement to MS’s inadequate attempt in the <SHF><F1> “Reveal Formatting” pane.

 


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As computer scientists we are trained to communicate with the dumbest things in the world – computers –
so you’d think we’d be able to communicate quite well with people.
Prof. Doug Fisher

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I would be looking for a phantom object, perhaps anchored to the footer, that text is wrapping around. See http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Formatting/UnaccountablyIndented.htm for an example of one of the kinds of problems this can cause.
Microsoft MVP (Word) since 1999
Fairhope, Alabama USA
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http://wordfaqs.ssbarnhill.com
Screen shots captured with TechSmith's Snagit

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Thank you both for your efforts and assistance.

Suzanne: If there were a "phantom" object causing the breaks (they appear in several places in the document, by the way, I only took screenshots of one of those places), wouldn't they appear in Word 2010 as well?  The document is perfect in both 2010 and 365 until I save it in 365 format (without compatibility mode checked).  Then it "breaks".

Rohn007: I'll check out both the article and the add-on tool in the morning, thank you.  It does seem to be a compatibility issue, and I hope I can figure out what.  I could continue to save the document in compatibility mode, I suppose, but it rather defeats the purpose of paying for the latest version of Office, plus makes it all too easy to "break" my documents if I should forget to check that box.  Since the problem appears in random places, that could be a nightmare in a 60,000 word book file. 

I will also attempt to extract segments and see if they remain "broken" and post them tomorrow if so.  Thanks for the suggestion.

Yes, the mystery breaks all show up in the middle of sentences, in the middle of paragraphs.

By the way, I checked "draft view" because that was what the help files on the Microsoft website said to do in the section on Word inserting page breaks where they don't belong (as the breaks themselves show up as dotted lines in that mode).  However, it appears there are no actual "breaks" in the document in those places.

Thank you again; I'll report back when I've had a chance to investigate further.  I really appreciate you taking the time to help.

--Gayle



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It is too obvious to ask, but ... , did you turn on the "Show feature" to show hidden formatting characters like line breaks, spaces and tabs.

I don't expect your problem to be any of those characters, but it may be visible as one of the others.

On feature I'm wondering if you have turned on is the paragraph "Keep with Next" option on the "broken" paragraph and the following one.

The specific compatibility Options I am thinking are found in File menu > Options command > Advanced option. Scroll down to the very bottom. In 2013 many of the compatibility options are hidden in 2013 format, but displayed in other formats. I suspect your issue is with one or more of these very esoteric settings.
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*****
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As computer scientists we are trained to communicate with the dumbest things in the world – computers –
so you’d think we’d be able to communicate quite well with people.
Prof. Doug Fisher

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Hi, Rohn007, and thanks again.  

Yes, I'd mentioned in my first post: "nor do they show up when I click the show/hide paragraph marks, breaks, etc."  Nothing shows up there; according to Word there is no break of any kind positioned in that spot, just a space between words.  No, "Keep with Next" is not turned on anywhere in the document (I checked the affected paragraphs as well as the paragraphs before and after in each instance, and there are no options checked that would cause this) and I'd checked the compatibility options in the Advanced section.  The only thing checked there is "Word 2010 Compatibility", which was checked by default when I installed Office 365 -- I've changed nothing in those settings.  I wouldn't dare, since I don't even know what most of them mean.  LOL

The truly odd thing is that these lines are breaking right in the middle of a paragraph/sentence, and fairly high up on the page in each case.

I've got some important work to do this morning but am going to attempt to extract examples a bit later and see if they still "break" in those places.  If so, I'll post them to SkyDrive and give links here.

Thanks again for your help, everyone.


Gayle

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Well.  The good news is that now only one spot in the file is doing that weird break thing.  I couldn't get the other places to replicate the problem again (after having "fixed" it by saving in compatibility mode).

However, when resaving in Word 2013/365 mode without the compatibility box checked, that first spot centered around the coat with the fox collar is still doing the break.

Here is an excerpt that shows it:


Watch, it won't show up on anyone's copy of Word 365 but mine.  LOL  

Comical Aside: Many years ago, in the days before Microsoft ever came out with their first PC ... no, really! And yes, my first "IBM Compatible" was a DOS-based PS/1 which, of course, now refers to an "antiquated" gaming system.  LOL.  Where was I?  Oh ... I was using Commodore computers and connecting through BBS systems and online on Qlink, then GEnie, etc. I had a couple of front-end interface developers falling over me, begging me to beta test for them.  Why?  "You can break things in ways no one else could ever dream of!"

My claim to fame.  <G>  But things were so much simpler then....


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Good news, the problem hasn't disappeared!

Better (or maybe worse) news is that the 'broken' paragraph DOES have "keep with next" turned on, and turning it off, unbreaks it.   With cursor in the paragraph, Home tab > Paragraph group > Dialog Launcher button (that little blur on the group name level) to open the "Paragraph" dialog box. Click on the "Lines and Page Breaks" tab.  The "offending" check box is the second from the top.

That still leaves a big ugly white space between the paragraphs.

Turning off "Keep with next" in the next para move it up to the previous page. Repeat through the whole document

In other words, you should turn off "Keep with next" in your whole document. It should not be applied to the body text of the whole document. It should only be used in limited places.

The clue for me was the artificial break 2 lines from the end of the paragraph. That is a "symptom" of the "Widow and Orphan Control" option.  Without it turned on, you would only see one line on the next page.



PS: you sound like an average "computer user". As a professional software developer I long ago learned to "expect the unexpected" from "typical users".  I would build something perfectly logical, and the user testers or "real" users would come back, figuratively scratching their heads saying "it's broke" or "why did you do that ..." . Then when they describe the problem, I would be the one scratching his head, thinking very quietly, "who in their right mind would do THAT!" <grin>. Of course, the first reply is "Well, DON'T DO THAT!"  (punch line from a bad doctor joke ... "Dr, Dr., it hurts when I do this ..." ).  "Users" are the downside of being a programmer. They don't think like programmers, and it hurts our brains trying to think like them <grin>.

.
*****
.
As computer scientists we are trained to communicate with the dumbest things in the world – computers –
so you’d think we’d be able to communicate quite well with people.
Prof. Doug Fisher

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This is so bizarre.

I did check for "Keep with Next" in the original document that exhibited the problem and didn't find it turned on anywhere in the offending paragraphs, nor in the paragraphs before or after them.  It was one of the first things I checked, as suggested in the help faqs on the Microsoft website.  Honest!  LOL

When I re-opened the file in the Public SkyDrive folder, the same one you just looked at, suddenly the paragraph was where it was supposed to be, with no breaks.  It had been broken when I uploaded the file to SkyDrive.

I checked the Widow/Orphan control setting page, and "Keep with Next" was turned ON.  I UNchecked the box ... and the paragraph broke again!

I then selected all text in the document and went in and UNchecked all of the boxes in that section.

It fixed the paragraph break problem.

I'll have to mess with every document, I guess, toggling that setting on and off until it does what it's supposed to do.  Either that or just keep the compatibility box in the Save dialog checked.

As to your astute observations as a programmer ... I wasn't doing anything out of the ordinary whenever I "broke" a piece of beta software, just following the steps the programmer asked me to and expecting the software to do what the programmer said it was supposed to do.  Honest!  LOL

Like now. <G>










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It's magic ...

First, check the relevant styles, probably NORMAL. Make sure the option is not turned on there so you don't keep creating the problem.

To fix existing documents, use <CTL><A> to select the whole document then go into the dialog and turn it of. When you enter the dialog the check box will be greyed out. Click on it once to turn it on in all of the selection, then click on it again to turn it off. Do that for both options I mentioned.

Don't micromanage. The Keep with next option should only be used in specific places. Normally you should let word handle the page breaks in paragraphs.

"Appropriate" places are heading styles (ie to always keep the heading together with the body text), or the 2 paragraphs holding a picture and its caption, or in a small table.

.
*****
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As computer scientists we are trained to communicate with the dumbest things in the world – computers –
so you’d think we’d be able to communicate quite well with people.
Prof. Doug Fisher

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"Keep with Next" is actually something I've never used, in any document, willingly, for as long as I've been using Word.  So unless it comes automatically turned on in the Normal style in Word 2013/365, I have no idea how it got turned on in the first place, why it was UNchecked when I first looked, or why, most oddly, it would only have affected two or three paragraphs, splitting them in the middle of the paragraph, in the whole document.

I most definitely didn't set it.

I'll check the style, though, it's the only way that option could have been checked in that document.  It is NOT checked in the Word 2010 file when I open it on the old desktop (the program it was created in).

But I really do greatly appreciate your time.  I'm still baffled, but at least I know now what to do to remedy the situation (hopefully!) should it happen again.


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Last updated December 28, 2023 Views 464 Applies to: