A Definitive Thread: The Incentive to Win

TL;DR - spawn031 Youtube Discussion video


Rather than writing a witty introduction, I have decided to cut to the chase and discuss the global changes that should be made to Reach. I say global because the problems I address are on a global scale with this video game. Not discussing Infection maps, Loadout Cams, Loadout Selections, Armor Lock, Bloom, Banshee Spam. Those are all minor discussion to what I am talking about.

I am talking about what actually keeps the player playing the video game. What does keep you playing? Is it playing with your friends all the time? Is it the incentive to unlock certain armor? What about getting that ranking symbol next to your gamertag? How about maintaining a certain division in Arena? Did you want to make that awesome forge map and see it achieve success in matchmaking? Maybe you're a hardcore campaigner (<---spelling?).

My point is whatever keeps players playing reach, has a vastly different effect than players that played Halo 2/3. At this time after Halo 3's release, it was achieving higher numbers (player population) than Halo Reach is. That is a fact and we all know it. Granted that Halo Reach's population is still maintaining a high number every day and with continued DLC and (hopefully) a nice title update, players will come back to reach. For future reference, if all you post is "adapt" you should just leave this thread. You bring no discussion value to this topic, wasting everyones time, and making yourself look like a fool. (Wit'cha pants on tha ground!)

[quote]So why are players leaving Reach?[/quote]

To answer this question, we have to go back to the roots of what Halo gaming is. Remember back in those glory days of Halo: CE playing all night LAN fests with your buddies and not going to bed. Having those crazy moments where you wanted to be the best player in the room? What about loading up campaign at night with your brothers and having your mother yell at you at 2 in the morning to get to bed (even though its the weekend)?

Do you remember those times? What about playing Halo 2 and being at a competitive tournament at a local card of gameshop? You wanted to win that free video game giftcard and have that cash in your hand by the end of the night. What do all of these examples have in common? The Halo that we all grew up to know over the past 10 years has changed dramatically BUT HOW? Especially with online gaming!!!

[quote]Halo Reach has no incentive to win games[/quote]

All that competitive edge that existed prior to Halo Reachs release is long gone. Gone are the days where we fight in matchmaking as a team to achieve more enemy territories on Sandtrap, gone are the times where we struggle to maintain a position of holding an Oddball for 10 more seconds with a full team rushing in on us for the win. Gone are the Epic Flag run's

that existed back in Halo 3.

In Reach, you don't need to win. Its that simple. With the introduction of the credit system, back in the Halo: Reach beta, many people realized that our new ranking system is simply based on time. Bungie had an approach to capitalize on this by "morphing" how slayer is. Remember back in the Beta days of Reach to the Halo Reach Carnage Carnivals?

I sure do. I remember seeing that video many times and thinking about the new Arena system and how players would actually try to win those games. With all the new weapons and graphics, Armor Abilities, a whole new sandbox of weapons and vehicles to play with, it was going to be AMAZING!

But I was wrong......

Arena is nothing more than a playlist full of KD hoarders. Arena is a playlist that should be broken up into "Ranked" and "Social" much like Halo 2/3 did. As described in the video, everything is in slayer. Slayer SLAYER SLAYER! I don't know about you, but I think compeditive capture the flag or Oddball would be awesome! Why do we change something that worked so great in prior Halo games!?!?

We had such a high support base from all players during 2004-2010 before Halo Reach. It was excellent! Players were actually PLAYING TO WIN THE GAME! The credit system doesn't promote winning in the slightest. If you want to rank up faster in Reach, simply sit back and build up your KD in any playlist. You're better off picking every off with the DMR, than actually getting in that hill and fighting for your life. Granted it still amazes me that people constantly rush the objective and die when this game has been out for 6+ months.

If there is one thing that should be changed, Winning a game in matchmaking for Reach should impact more than simply giving you a lousy +300 credits. Who cares about those. If there was to be a competitive playlist where the gameplay actually rewards winning matches, you would slowly start to see the competitive edge and more community members come back into Halo Reach. There is no incentive to win Reach and that is what sucks the most.

[quote]How can you expect to matchmake teams together and expect them to be a team, when the ranking system doesn't even impact winning?[/quote]

It boggles my mind how this occurs. The ranking system doesn't even reward winning, and many people wonder why you have that guy sitting on the sniper spawn, or betraying your teammates, giving the enemy players your banshee, and having those AFK players inside of a Hemorrhage base doing nothing. How do expect players to play the game that we all know as Halo when the ranking system doesn't even reward winning?


...where do I start.

Arena has been changed in the recent months to a win/loss record for division placement. No more are the days of EMPing your own teammates to gain assists off of them. (Yeah believe me, people were that desperate for an Arena Ranking) It was a mistake to incorporate a "Hardcore" system of matchmaking that doesn't reward winning games. "Just get that number up!" Who cares about winning!

Your Arena division should be VISIBLE in ALL Halo Reach lobbies!

Talk about a low population count in Arena barely surviving. You want to know why no one plays Arena? THERE IS NOTHING YOU GET OUT OF IT! Think back to Halo 3. Why did people play ranked playlists? Because they had to increase their Global Rank! In Halo Reach we have 2 completely independent ranking systems: Arena and Social. Your Arena rank has no impact on your Social/Global rank so why play it? why earn that intense Onyx division when its going to be wiped off your profile in a month, or three months? There is no incentive to play that playlist, which is why you see the population of Arena dropping everyday.

Arenas gameplay is suppose to glorify the mechanics of Halo Reach to its fullest. Being the most "competitive" of all Halo Reach playlists I would expect to see objective in Arena since the formula of Division ranking is now based off of win/loss. Nope, still slayer, which is why I don't play it personally.

[quote]Halo 3 Ranked we had:

>Team Slayer(4v4)

>Team Objective(4v4)

>Team SWAT(4v4)

>Team Snipers(4v4)


>Team Doubles(2v2)

>Squad Battle(6v6)

>Various XXP Ranked weekends[/quote]

[quote]Halo Reach we have:

>The Arena(4v4)[/quote]


I like variety in my competitive playlist experience. Its sad that Bungie promoted the Arena for the hardcore gamers, yet there is no objective still in based on win/loss. :/ [quote]Conclusion[/quote]

There is no incentive to win games in Halo Reach. If you want to get a higher rank quicker, don't rush the objective, stay back, and rack up on that KD spread. I should get something because I WON the game and my opponents lost. In Halo 3 that was getting 1 xp point and going up a rank. In Reach... there isn't anything. You get a lousy +300 cR for it. What about the players that about care less about cR? What do they get for winning? The satisfaction! LOL Welcome to the internet! We all want shiny ranks and emblems to show our progress of awesomeness.

When there is nothing to achieve in any playlists, how can you expect players to stick around? For the DLC? Maybe for a day.... how about new armor? Nope. Players want core mechanics changed, such as seeing your Reach division symbol on your tag would motivate players to play Arena. I think its a start and avoiding this whole "We play Halo Reach to win armor" just isn't cutting it for most people. Especially when they are Brigadier - General ranks and they have all the armor they want. There is no more motivation to play Halo Reach.



Discussion Info

Last updated July 3, 2018 Views 0 Applies to:

Agreed. Reach is bad for Competive play.

I don't think you can blame the dip on the overall player amount on the fact that everyone ranks up no matter what.

After all, COD is still wildly popular and it's had the 'ranking up for dumies' since COD4.


When Halo 2 came out the only major competitor on Live was Return to Castle Wolfenstein and that had already been out for over a year.  When there isn't much choice of course the player base will be much bigger for the few games at that time that were quality.


I think people are either competitive when they play or not.  When I played Halo2-3 I always tried just as hard in social playlists as I did in ranked, it's not something I can just turn off or on.  When I'm playing any FPS against other players I try, I figure why bother otherwise?


I do agree though with the 'everyone can be a high rank' stuff, it does make rank pointless...  But to some extent rank always was pointless, we all remember playing people with level 50 accounts in past Halo games who sucked because they bought the account or were carried there by far superior friends.



Wow RETARDED new forums... had a long, well thought out post but it didn't post for some reason? Really really stupid.


I'll just summarize my three main points. 


Halo's population is fine and is extremely high. It's only getting beat by the biggest franchise of the next generation of gaming in Call of Duty. It's like saying the guy who has 40 billion dollars is a failure compared to the guy with 50 billion. Both games are insanely successful! 


Arena needs a few tweaks yes. I think the biggest problem is it's only Team Slayer. Bring back the Arena playlist selection deal (Like how you can go to Competitive and Community) and throw in Team Slayer, Team Objective, 6v6, Snipers, SWAT, etc. and it would be exactly like Halo 3's system, which I believed worked very well. 


The cR system needs a big boost in your actual performance in the game... Like your Game Complete is 1500 and you only get 3-400 for Commendations and Performance bonus. Make it so for an average game, you get 1500 for the Game Complete and 1500 as well for Commendations and Performance, as well as a small winning bonus. Boom, makes it so AFK'ing gets you barely anything.