BCC on mail sent via SMTP using outlook.com.

I See in this thread http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook_com/forum/opeople-ocontacts/outlookcom-moving-addresses-from-bcc-field-to-the/b4505d03-7b66-4f98-a878-f1d82fcf42a6 that Ron Summers has on Further testing determined that the outlook.com mail servers fail to be RFC compliance in that they do not send mail to BCC recipients from their SMTP service.

As this is a clear violation of the relevant RFC I was wondering

  1. Where Microsoft document their decision to not live up to the standard set by the RFC
  2. When they will be taking remedial action to restore their service to standards compliance
  3. When users will be advised of the limitation being placed on mail clients on the outlook.com mail service.  

Those that do not use web mail are entitled to at least the courtesy of making them aware your service has been deliberately crippled.  They can then make an informed decision to use or not to use your service.  As it fails to meet even the minimum standards to be considered a mail provider in that it can not send.

I suggest the following from Microsoft.

Documentation of exactly what limitations they have placed on their SMTP service.  These should include.

  1. The decision to disable POP access to all Hotmail account on transfer to outlook.com and a reason why this change to users expressly set preferences was required.
  2. The duplication of send mail in IMAP accounts as the client and server both save a sent copy.
  3. The inability of your SMTP server to use a BCC address.  Instead of rejecting the mail or warning the user you simply silently drop the information and make support work for the relevant mail client.
  4. The inability to use your alias feature in a mail client as your SMTP server expressly changes the information the client inserts.
  5. Any other limitation  included in the SMTP service that limit the functionality to something other than what a reasonable person would expect from someone offering a mail service.

 

Question Info


Last updated February 12, 2018 Views 656 Applies to:

Hi,

As the suggestions provided by you will be better addressed by the support team, I suggest you to refer the below link. You may contact the support from there.

http://postmaster.live.com

Hope this helps. Do get back to us in case you have any query related to Outlook.com in future.  

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Hi,

As the suggestions provided by you will be better addressed by the support team, I suggest you to refer the below link. You may contact the support from there.

http://postmaster.live.com

Hope this helps. Do get back to us in case you have any query related to Outlook.com in future.  

Well what part of that link goes to someone I can actually contact.

The page has three links

Here http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/outlook-help  Yep good old Microsoft.com  I think that just may be where you go when you start typing search queries into the web site.

Then there is

https://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx  A rather lengthy treatise on issues people have sending mail to Outlook.com.  Nice but totally irrelevant.  This is a mail client sending outgoing mail via outlook.com.

Finally a list of SMTP error codes for email being send to outlook.com. https://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx

So, as I would have expected from answers.microsoft.com,  nothing of any use in answering the questions I have.  All good information,  but irrelevant.  Do you even know that SMTP is used by mail clients when sending mail via outlook.com?  That is not everyone logs into a web page to send mail.  Personally I see the offering to be so crippled as to be about useless and recommend folk to use a real email service instead of this crippled offering.  I regularly recommend GMX as they simply do what they say they will do. Send and receive mail.you are sending me off to look at things designed for those sending mail TO outlook.com.

Is there anyone in the support team that understands email?  Please speak up.  I do not mean understands the outlook.com web interface.  I mean understand the platform this web interface is supposed to be built on.  IMAP/POP/SMTP.

I am a user needing support.  But I really do not want to see a long list if support articles on the web site.  I want answers to questions.

Are these problems with your site bugs, or intentional vendor lock-in decisions and planed anti competitive actions to make mail clients that do not use your proprietary exchange active sync look bad?

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Now I get an email reminding me this topic has not been answered yet.  Just what I need.  A reminder on how difficult it is to get an sort of useful response from these fora. Apparently I need to post an update.  Seriously.  Here is my update.

IT is now a week and no one has managed to tell me anything about this or why it is so.  Good one Microsoft.  It is a good thing this is free.  It is certainly not worth paying for.

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reallygnarly:

Several of us who have "Outlook" "Live", "Hotmail", "MSN" Microsoft email accounts that have been migrated over to the new Outlook Mail and try to send email to addresses in the Bcc field from a desktop email client program (e.g. Postbox or Thunderbird), use the outgoing Microsoft Outlook.com SMTP server for the hosting and transfer process. That server will no longer send emails to those listed in the Bcc field for some reason when a desktop email program is used to compose and send the email through that Microsoft Outlook.com SMTP. 

Who knows when MS is going to look into this problem or whether MS even wants to fix it. I think it has something to do with Microsoft changing to new API protocols for handling all MS mail accounts using the new Outlook Mail and Outlook.com server.

Now, if we could just get someone to acknowledge whether or not MS plans to fix this Bcc problem. If yes, then we know to wait. If no, then we know to give up and use some other SMTP when we send emails using addresses in the Bcc field. To date, no acknowledgement has been given.

I thank you for getting involved.

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Hi all,

I replied on Laurel's other thread but I will reply here for completeness. Thank you for reporting this issue. This is a bug which has been identified and we have a fix for it. This fix is being tested and will roll out soon. I will reply to this thread once the fix is fully rolled out. We are also looking into why these reports did not get escalated to us more quickly.

Regards,

Sean

Outlook.com Email Transport team

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Thank you for that.  As the support lead for the Thunderbird mail client,  I can assure you things would escalate more quickly if we had some way of contacting Microsoft with what we consider bugs in their products.  But access to someone at Microsoft for such purposes is something we do not have, but would dearly like to have.

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Please reach out on LinkedIn and I'll make sure you have just that.

Regards,

Sean Stevenson

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reallygnarly:

Several of us who have "Outlook" "Live", "Hotmail", "MSN" Microsoft email accounts that have been migrated over to the new Outlook Mail and try to send email to addresses in the Bcc field from a desktop email client program (e.g. Postbox or Thunderbird), use the outgoing Microsoft Outlook.com SMTP server for the hosting and transfer process. That server will no longer send emails to those listed in the Bcc field for some reason when a desktop email program is used to compose and send the email through that Microsoft Outlook.com SMTP. 

Who knows when MS is going to look into this problem or whether MS even wants to fix it. I think it has something to do with Microsoft changing to new API protocols for handling all MS mail accounts using the new Outlook Mail and Outlook.com server.

Now, if we could just get someone to acknowledge whether or not MS plans to fix this Bcc problem. If yes, then we know to wait. If no, then we know to give up and use some other SMTP when we send emails using addresses in the Bcc field. To date, no acknowledgement has been given.

I thank you for getting involved.

This is exactly the issue I have. bcc failed and went to TB because Livemail became unsupported. Based on past unrepaired issues by MS,

I switched to a different smtp server and bcc now works fine. PS I also experienced a hack of my email account either because of or simultaneously with sending by bcc. 

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Hi,

The fix has now rolled out to about 75% of our servers. Feel free to test BCC to see if it has reached your mailbox and if not, that should happen over the next week or so.

Also, feel free to reach out to me to create a support channel for Thunderbird.

Regards,

Sean

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